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Morgan 4/4

 
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Racing Teatray
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 6:05 pm    Post subject: Morgan 4/4  Reply with quote

At least I think it...

Some Spanish friends of ours came around for lunch in their delightfully patinated old British racing green Moggie. Apparently the chassis is from the late 1950s (I forgot which year he said) and was then rebuilt in 1973 with a 1800cc Fiat Twincam from a 124 Spider, hence the K-plate.

Lovely thing. He actively encouraged me to take it for a spin. That's not easy in central London, so I just took it for a blast over Wandsworth Bridge and up to the Common and back. Very vintage and utterly fantastic. Sounded superb going through the underpasses - I'd be surprised if it has any silencers - sounded straight-cut to me (he didn't know) and the Fiat engine sounds absolutely fitting. There's no way to properly review it but it was just wall-to-wall charm.

The brakes were unservoed (which accurately autocorrects as "unnerved"!), the 5spd gearbox very short-throw - it was little more than a click, but the free-revving engine was absolutely a joyous thing with just enough temperament to make things interesting and require you to keep your wits firmly about it. Not much by way of suspension and the indicator switch was novel...

I can quite see why people love these things.


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PhilD
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My Car: Fiat Grande Punto Sporting

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 7:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If i was you Racing I'd have been tempted to dirty my terracotta chinos and have a look underneath at the exhausts.

An open top car on a sunny autumn day is my idea of heaven (though it would have to be a 4 seater these days!)
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Racing Teatray
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There wasn't time and perhaps the effect is lost when you are merely wearing jeans...
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PhilD
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you allowed to drive a Morgan in jeans?

So how come some Spaniards have the quintessential British sports car with an Italian engine?

And in related news, what's does Mrs Racing think of the new Fiat Spider?
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Racing Teatray
Nuclear

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think they were both wearing jeans as well!

They are quite cosmopolitan in good London style.

Mrs R likes the new Spider.
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Martin
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PhilD wrote:
If i was you Racing I'd have been tempted to dirty my terracotta chinos and have a look underneath at the exhausts.

An open top car on a sunny autumn day is my idea of heaven (though it would have to be a 4 seater these days!)


Sunny Autumn day, clear evening, warm day, hot day, cold but clear day etc etc.  The roof is really only up on ours when it's raining or below 5c, as it's an even better experience driven that way.

The Morgan is a bit basic for me, but I like to see them being used.  There was a decent sized gathering at Woburn when we had our last wedding meeting there, I had a look and a chat with some of the owners.  They were very enthusiastic and loved someone showing an interest.

The car mags don't like the Spyder, I've not read anything in detail, but it seems Fiat have messed it up a bit?  It does look better than the Mazda.
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PhilD
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PhilD wrote:


An open top car on a sunny autumn day is my idea of heaven (though it would have to be a 4 seater these days!)


Just noticed you say it's a 4/4. Is that right?
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Racing Teatray
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 9:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not sure.
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PhilD
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Martin wrote:


The car mags don't like the Spyder, I've not read anything in detail, but it seems Fiat have messed it up a bit?  It does look better than the Mazda.


Yeah but as you know there a lot more to this sort of car than just the handling. Seen a few now and the styling is not as bad as the mags say either. It is odd how much bigger/weightier it looks than the MX5 but I'm not sure that's a bad thing.
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Big Blue
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 10:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bloody hell thats a bit hoo-ray Henry

Looks fabulous fun but Sunday use only.

BTW the Fiat looks at least a million times better than the Mazda.
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Racing Teatray
Nuclear

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 10:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

More hooray Jose I guess...
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Roadsterstu
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 8:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

James will be along any time now to confirm if it is a 4/4 or not. I have no idea.

As for the Fiat 124 Spyder, it looks pretty good outside but the interior is just like the Mazda and that's where it fails in my view. Its a shame the dash, at least, isn't a bit more "Italian sports car".
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PG
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the mags don't rate the Spyder as it does not handle like the Mazda. But handling is not everything in an open topped sportscar. To me the Fiat looks way better and whilst standard Mazda fare inside, the leather and some of the fittings are said to be of better quality than the Mazda (per Autocar review this week).
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Nice Guy Eddie
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whats the Abarth one like?

They look pretty cool to me with their matt bonnet and the possibility to Rally spec them.
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PG
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 11:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is putting a Fiat engine in a 1953 4/4 the recognised upgrade or sacrilege?
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Frank Bullitt
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 11:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like that people buy and drive Morgan's but to be honest they hold nonapeal to me.
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Humphrey The Pug
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frank Bullitt wrote:
I like that people buy and drive Morgan's but to be honest they hold nonapeal to me.


+1 on both accounts.
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Racing Teatray
Nuclear

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frank Bullitt wrote:
I like that people buy and drive Morgan's but to be honest they hold nonapeal to me.


They never held any appeal for me either, but I hugely enjoyed driving it (as a pure toy).

Turns out my current trainee's dad has an Aero 8 which he hardly ever drives having twice pranged it!
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Racing Teatray
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I also realise it counts as the oldest car I have ever driven!

Previously it had a 1961 Jaguar MkII 3.8 that my father used to have.
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Michael
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 2:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PG wrote:
I think the mags don't rate the Spyder as it does not handle like the Mazda. But handling is not everything in an open topped sportscar. To me the Fiat looks way better and whilst standard Mazda fare inside, the leather and some of the fittings are said to be of better quality than the Mazda (per Autocar review this week).


The Fiat is a missed opportunity. It reminds me of the Ford Thunderbird they launched in the early 2000's - looking to the past too much for longevity. The Mazda is an acquired taste but it's nothing if not modern and progressive. I think they look rather good and I'd have one over the Fiat every day of the week.
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Scouse
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 4:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Racing Teatray wrote:
More hooray Jose I guess...


I think hooray Enrique may be the correct one!

Wasn't the 4/4 the normal two seater and the Plus 4 the longer one that was available as a (bloody ugly) four seater?
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Roadrunner
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 9:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just found this thread. How could I miss it!

Morgan offered the option of a 2 litre FIAT twin cam engine in the early '80s and it was well liked by Morgan aficionados. The free revving engine and slick gearbox combination is ideal for a Morgan so I can see why the conversion works so well. It is no secret on here that I consider a well sorted Morgan to be the perfect car for a B-road blast, as it provides the perfect antidote to modern, sanitised motoring.

The 4/4 model designation refers to the fact that the car has four wheels and a four cylinder engine, both of which were novel features to the Morgan driver in the 1930s! The name has stuck ever since. The Plus 4 is an uprated version of the 4/4, with a more powerful engine and, in more recent years, wider wheels and wider wings. The earlier Plus 4 had the 2 litre Triumph engine out of the TR2, while 4/4s have, since the 1950s, generally used Ford engines. As the Plus 4 has phased in and out of production over the years it has had the FIAT 2 litre, the Rover M16 and T16 2 litre (not well loved) and currently the Ford Duratec 2 litre. The four seater models are just referred to as 4/4 Four Seater and Plus 4 Four Seater.
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Racing Teatray
Nuclear

My Car: BMW 440i GC and Fiat 500

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Roadrunner wrote:
Just found this thread. How could I miss it!

Morgan offered the option of a 2 litre FIAT twin cam engine in the early '80s and it was well liked by Morgan aficionados. The free revving engine and slick gearbox combination is ideal for a Morgan so I can see why the conversion works so well. It is no secret on here that I consider a well sorted Morgan to be the perfect car for a B-road blast, as it provides the perfect antidote to modern, sanitised motoring.

The 4/4 model designation refers to the fact that the car has four wheels and a four cylinder engine, both of which were novel features to the Morgan driver in the 1930s! The name has stuck ever since. The Plus 4 is an uprated version of the 4/4, with a more powerful engine and, in more recent years, wider wheels and wider wings. The earlier Plus 4 had the 2 litre Triumph engine out of the TR2, while 4/4s have, since the 1950s, generally used Ford engines. As the Plus 4 has phased in and out of production over the years it has had the FIAT 2 litre, the Rover M16 and T16 2 litre (not well loved) and currently the Ford Duratec 2 litre. The four seater models are just referred to as 4/4 Four Seater and Plus 4 Four Seater.


So what did I drive? A 4/4 or a Plus 4!?
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PhilD
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 11:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Was it 4 wheel drive? Might have been the 4/4x4 Plus 4 Four Seater.
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Roadrunner
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 12:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Racing Teatray wrote:
Roadrunner wrote:
Just found this thread. How could I miss it!

Morgan offered the option of a 2 litre FIAT twin cam engine in the early '80s and it was well liked by Morgan aficionados. The free revving engine and slick gearbox combination is ideal for a Morgan so I can see why the conversion works so well. It is no secret on here that I consider a well sorted Morgan to be the perfect car for a B-road blast, as it provides the perfect antidote to modern, sanitised motoring.

The 4/4 model designation refers to the fact that the car has four wheels and a four cylinder engine, both of which were novel features to the Morgan driver in the 1930s! The name has stuck ever since. The Plus 4 is an uprated version of the 4/4, with a more powerful engine and, in more recent years, wider wheels and wider wings. The earlier Plus 4 had the 2 litre Triumph engine out of the TR2, while 4/4s have, since the 1950s, generally used Ford engines. As the Plus 4 has phased in and out of production over the years it has had the FIAT 2 litre, the Rover M16 and T16 2 litre (not well loved) and currently the Ford Duratec 2 litre. The four seater models are just referred to as 4/4 Four Seater and Plus 4 Four Seater.


So what did I drive? A 4/4 or a Plus 4!?


Could be either. Other than the badge on radiator cowl there is no external difference on models of that age. Even if it were originally a 4/4, it would be fair to say that it has been upgraded to Plus 4 spec.
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Roadrunner
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 12:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PhilD wrote:
Was it 4 wheel drive? Might have been the 4/4x4 Plus 4 Four Seater.


There are rumours of a possbile switch to a three cylinder engine in the '4/4' sometime in the near future. Would that have to be called 4/3 or a 3/4?
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Roadrunner
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 1:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wibble

http://www.williamsautomobiles.co...istol/avon/16791179?frch=williams

I need to go for a lie down...
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Roadsterstu
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 9:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Roadrunner wrote:
Just found this thread. How could I miss it!

Morgan offered the option of a 2 litre FIAT twin cam engine in the early '80s and it was well liked by Morgan aficionados. The free revving engine and slick gearbox combination is ideal for a Morgan so I can see why the conversion works so well. It is no secret on here that I consider a well sorted Morgan to be the perfect car for a B-road blast, as it provides the perfect antidote to modern, sanitised motoring.

The 4/4 model designation refers to the fact that the car has four wheels and a four cylinder engine, both of which were novel features to the Morgan driver in the 1930s! The name has stuck ever since. The Plus 4 is an uprated version of the 4/4, with a more powerful engine and, in more recent years, wider wheels and wider wings. The earlier Plus 4 had the 2 litre Triumph engine out of the TR2, while 4/4s have, since the 1950s, generally used Ford engines. As the Plus 4 has phased in and out of production over the years it has had the FIAT 2 litre, the Rover M16 and T16 2 litre (not well loved) and currently the Ford Duratec 2 litre. The four seater models are just referred to as 4/4 Four Seater and Plus 4 Four Seater.


Took your time!


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