The Motor Forum

Turbonutter

Hmmm, it really is much slower than I expected for a 320bhp 4wd with sporting aspirations. Being 1930kg ( Touring version ) doesn't help but acceleration is broadly on a par to 100 with an E36 328i Touring manual.

Bit disappointing really.

End of term test on the Focus RS . I wonder how many have sold so far. Goodwin reveals Renault have sold 159 R26Rs over here and there are about 6 left still available.

Some blurb on the Merc SLS AMG as well and the McLaren MP4-12C

Pkh72 · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 8:53 am Post subject:

They have also slipped in an unannounced 10p increase as well.
Hardly bank breaking but they have gone over my cut off point where i thought it was worth it so i'm just going to get odd copies from now on.

I'm not getting time to read them anyway, i'm currently reading 5th August issue!

Turbonutter · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:03 am Post subject:

simonp · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 12:48 pm Post subject:

There aren't 6 R26.Rs left according to RUK, there were only 2 or 3 some weeks ago, which was last time I saw an update.

I can't believe the Insignia weighs nearly 2 tonnes! I think the 2.8T Elite is only about 1500kg in hatchback form. The VXR can't have much more kit than one of those so does the estate bodyshell add 400kg?

Dr. Hfuhruhurr · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 12:52 pm Post subject:

I'd like to see Autocar do a feature on weight of modern cars, especially the difference between the manufacturers' quoted weights and the actual weight as tested, and with the usual FG that most customers will spec. Some manufacturers - Audi and Jaguar in particular spring to mind - must fill their cars with helium to get their quoted weights, as they're invariably almost comically heavier by the time Autocar sticks them on the scales.

(insert obvious comment about Sutcliffe)

maz · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 2:41 pm Post subject:

Great first drive of the Alfa 159 1750, they quote 0 -60 in 7.7sec. and 217mph top speed ! wow,
and they complain its too heavy

Humphrey The Pug · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 2:46 pm Post subject:

R26R's sold out some months ago, well I say sold out, as they weren't selling Renault directed many of them back into mainland Europe.

Shame really that they couldn't shift only 230, there are more dealers than that, well probably not now as many have shut up shop.

I have seen at least 4 Focus RS' on the road but no Megane's and I did read that the initial 3000 of orders that Ford thought they would get for the prejected run of the car sold out pretty quickly and so more are being built as they weren't a limited run.

*edit* Ive just found two but they are at dealers and they have had them for 99 days and 92 days, I wouldn't be surprised if they are sold and the system hasn't been updated.
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Turbonutter · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 2:48 pm Post subject:

maz · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 2:55 pm Post subject:

Turbonutter · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 6:05 pm Post subject:

cbeaks1

Matt · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:46 pm Post subject:

It's a shocker the Insignia is so slow with that power - must be some large drivetrain losses or the German cars turn up stronger than their quoted figures. It'll be good to see figures of the hatch or saloon.
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Small car, big heart.

Martin · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:49 pm Post subject:

What are the numbers for the VXR?

Is it not quite in the M5 league as suggested by Cropley?!!

Passat R36 for me please.
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Matt · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:54 pm Post subject:

They placed it above the R36

1. 335i - 4 stars
2. C350 - 3.5 stars
3. VXR - 3.5 stars
4. S4 Avant - 3.5 stars
5. R36 - 3 stars

The numbers for the VXR (Audi in brackets)

321bhp at 5250 (328 at 5500-7000)
321lb ft at 5250 (324 at 2900-5300)
6.7 to 60 (5.2 claimed to 62)
1940kg claimed (1705kg claimed)
274g/km, 24.2mpg combined (229 and 21.2 combined)
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Small car, big heart.

Martin · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 11:06 pm Post subject:

0-60 in 6.7

I hope I come across one in the Clubman, that would be hilarious

As a used buy and nearer £20k, I bet the R36 would do better and at least it looks nice!

1940kg is ridiculous, my FG 520d will only weigh 1545kg and that's with fuel, luggage and a driver on board. It won't take much to get the VXR to 2 tonnes!!
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Blarno · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 11:30 pm Post subject:

Maybe manufacturers will learn that they can't overcome weight by adding more power. 6.7 to 60 is abysmal for a 320 Bhp car. That's as powerful as an E36 M3 Evo, give or take a few ponies and that was a sub 6 second car.
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Turbonutter · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 11:38 pm Post subject:

Martin · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 11:43 pm Post subject:

I've checked and it's actually 1580kg in the trim level I'm getting, but that's still pretty light for the size of car.

It's the latest E60 in M Sport trim. I couldn't believe it at first myself, but it weighs the same as a 320d Touring / 135i coupe and a lot less than the competition. The whole front end is Aluminium, which I guess makes a lot of difference and is why the 520d isn't quite the snail you'd think!

The C250 Sport I looked at is much smaller but 150kg heavier.

The new 5 Series GT goes back to all steel and is 400+ kg heavier (2035kg for a 530d SE)!

The weight I quoted is based on the std BMW measurement, which is something like a 90% full fuel tank, 60kg driver and 20kg (not sure about that one) of luggage. They are all weighed in the same way, so it's a likefor like comparison with the 320d.
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Matt · Posted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 11:55 pm Post subject:

You need a light car like the Astra at 1205kg, add that 4WD turbo drivetrain and give it to me, Vauxhall.

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Small car, big heart.

"him" · Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 12:02 am Post subject:

Turbonutter · Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 12:06 am Post subject:

Matt · Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 12:30 am Post subject:

I wonder if it was wet when they did the test, because the on the limit was talking about wet weather performance right from the start of the article, with a cursory glance to dry performance. Wouldn't be like Autocar to hamstring a Vauxhall, would it...

I still remember the Astra VXR getting 5 handling stars and the ST only had 4/4.5. The logic of that test was never repeated again, however.
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Small car, big heart.

simonp · Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 8:26 am Post subject:

Turbonutter · Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 8:33 am Post subject:

Twelfth Monkey · Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 8:54 am Post subject:

The gearing might be a little longer than a mainstream model, but the performance is utter pants. Far from being a cut-price M3 rival as hyped, it isn't even on 335i or S4 performance. I know that 0-60 isn't everything, but the A4 with the 3.2 is haf a second quicker to 60 than the VXR, and may even undercut it price wise.

Can't see them flying out of the showrooms.
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Turbonutter · Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:00 am Post subject:

"him" · Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:01 am Post subject:

Blarno · Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:54 am Post subject:

Heavy flywheels and crap gearboxes spoil the Vauxhall V6. It's a corking engine otherwise.
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Turbonutter · Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 11:27 am Post subject:

Blarno · Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 11:39 am Post subject:

The heavy flywheel helped with the top speed on the V6 Vectras. Nearly 150 mph was achievable in the GSi, from 198 Bhp. Heavy cars, too.

Before I owned my V6 SRi, it belonged to a friend and he had an indicated 140 out of it, with room to spare.
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Arms held out, in the Jesus Christ Pose.

DaveGibson · Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 12:52 pm Post subject:

I was following a silver coloured car on the motorway on Sunday that I didn't recognise, even though its tail lights were very distinctive. Every time I neared it, but not close enough to see the badge, a car (one of which was a Volvo estate carrying four kayaks on the roof) pulled in between us and slowed me down. When I finally got a clear run, the other car had disappeared. From this test, I now know it was an Insignia ST. From the rate it disappeared it must have had some power under the bonnet, so maybe it was a VXR.

simonp · Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 1:00 pm Post subject:

That 16.9 to 100 is pretty poor. I seem to recall that the Astra Coupe Turbo did it in 17.3 (in the Autocar roadtest) and that was only 190bhp!

Matt · Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 6:56 pm Post subject:

And if it put its power down on the road as badly as the 1.8 then that's a cracking time!

It seems odd they lumbered the V6s with a poor second gear, because it's very strong (for this level) on the two 1.8s I've driven.
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Small car, big heart.

Rodge · Posted: Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:58 pm Post subject:

simonp · Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 6:46 am Post subject:

Can I ask if the test mentions the electric handbrake? I'm starting to fancy a lesser Insignia as my next car and have read they're making this piece of FG standard across the range which is putting me off a bit!

PG · Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:14 am Post subject:

Now that I've read the article, my overall impression is that if it was £25k and front wheel drive they might be onto something. But at £33k and with those CO2 outputs (and let's face it, this will be a company purchase) I don't think we'll see many on the road.

Gurney · Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:21 am Post subject:

The CO2 is nearly as bad as the GTA (285) and that's the reason the Alfa engine was canned!

Performance for all that horsepower is shocking, something amiss somewhere. Still like this though, especially in wagon form.

Think it would have to be an R36 at the end of the day though.
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Dr. Hfuhruhurr · Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:23 am Post subject:

Gurney · Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 10:00 am Post subject:

TimR · Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 10:52 am Post subject:

Lose the wife and if that's not enough bin the smart

Gurney · Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 11:12 am Post subject:

TimR · Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 11:46 am Post subject:

Good point.

I've got an idea.

Your wife likes running and cycling.
If you're running short of cash at any point hook a treadmill or her bike up to a generator and supply your own electricity

DaveGibson · Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 12:57 pm Post subject:

"him" · Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 1:21 pm Post subject:

Just reading through what little data the Autocar site has online and I notice the Power to weight of 165 bhp per tonne.

Hopeless!
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simonp · Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 2:28 pm Post subject:

Blarno · Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 2:58 pm Post subject:

simonp · Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 3:03 pm Post subject:

Matt · Posted: Sat Sep 12, 2009 12:27 am Post subject:

Martin · Posted: Sun Sep 13, 2009 8:52 am Post subject:

According to the handbook, pressing the electronic handbrake switch in the Passat gave you additional emergency braking. I never tried it!!
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"him" · Posted: Sun Sep 13, 2009 12:18 pm Post subject: