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JohnC

Rather Quick

I haven't seen one in the flesh yet but a review of the brochure says it has a 0 - 62 time of 4.7s, is restricted to 155mph, puts out 313hp and 600Nm of torque and breathes out only 128g of CO2 per Km. It also sips fuel at a combined 52.3mpg.

It's the new 435D XDrive which puts a diesel firmly in amongst the supercars. The problem is that it costs £47,000 with a few obligatory extras including the now extra cost split folding rear seat which was standard on 3 Series Coupes for the past 15 years.

Too rich for me but a seriously rapid bit of transport.
Michael

Stupid name though.
Martin

The 4 wheel drive will help it get off the line, as will the excellent gearbox, but it's still very quick and would win most TLGPs in the real world. Good value for a company car driver as well.

The saloon appeals quite a lot.  Choose a subtle colour, delete all the badges and you have youself a great Q car.
Twelfth Monkey

A 0-60 in the mid-to-high fours is no longer anywhere near supercar-quick.
Martin

No, but it is Supersaloon quick, not bad for a wiesel.

You'll have to start being a bit more careful 12th!  
PR

I think what he means is that the Keating will get to 60 in two seconds flat!
Twelfth Monkey

Martin wrote:
No, but it is Supersaloon quick, not bad for a wiesel.

You'll have to start being a bit more careful 12th!  


At £50k or so, I don't suppose I'll be seeing too many of them.

Forget the Keatingernator, I don't think a top spec R8 at mid to high threes is supercar-quick anymore either.  The 458 as the 'baby' Ferrari has changed a lot in terms of performance expectation.
Martin

Twelfth Monkey wrote:
At £50k or so, I don't suppose I'll be seeing too many of them.


I wouldn't be so sure, there are plenty of 335d coupes around and the 335xd Saloon is under £34k on Broadspeed.  That's the one to watch out for!
JohnC

Twelfth Monkey wrote:
A 0-60 in the mid-to-high fours is no longer anywhere near supercar-quick.


I would still say that it is supercar quick but we now have Hypercars to raise (or lower) the times into the sub 4 second bracket. Anything faster than that should stay on a track!
Roadsterstu

For 12th, the mid 4s are popping to the shops quick or nipping to the post office quick or picking the kids up from school quick...

Stuntman

Re: Rather Quick

JohnC wrote:

It's the new 435D XDrive which puts a diesel firmly in amongst the supercars.


No it doesn't.

Still, impressive in its own right
Twelfth Monkey

JohnC wrote:
Twelfth Monkey wrote:
A 0-60 in the mid-to-high fours is no longer anywhere near supercar-quick.


I would still say that it is supercar quick but we now have Hypercars to raise (or lower) the times into the sub 4 second bracket. Anything faster than that should stay on a track!


I don't think that new classes need inventing to cover all increases in performance.  The F1, Veyron etc are examples where a new label was probably needed, but the likes of the GT-R, 458, 911 Turbo etc are still supercars to my way of thinking (OK, the GT-R isn't - I include it because of its ballistic 0-60 time), and like all car types, the level of performance expected has simply improved with time.

The used car buyers' guide of this week's Autocar features a Diablo, which in 1990 was offering 0-60 in 4.5s and 0-100 in 9.3.  The car you're referring to offers supercar performance (to 60 at any rate) from 20-25 years ago.

Interestingly, the Diablo piece is a bit more measured about the pitfalls and potential costs of running a Diablo than evo was last month...
PR

Twelfth Monkey wrote:
The Diablo featured in the used car buyers' guide of this week's Autocar features a Diablo, which in 1990 was offering 0-60 in 4.5s and 0-100 in 9.3.  The car you're referring to offers supercar performance (to 60 at any rate) from 20-25 years ago.


Isn't this in itself quite remarkable, though? That you can now get Lamborghini Diablo headline performance from a BMW 3-series diesel.
Twelfth Monkey

And from some hot hatches.  I wonder where we'll be in another twenty years' time.
PR

By then I imagine Dr Keating will have invented a car that accelerates so quickly it actually reverses time.
Twelfth Monkey

Or realised he's a bufoon?
JohnC

Twelfth Monkey wrote:
[quote="JohnC:467777The used car buyers' guide of this week's Autocar features a Diablo, which in 1990 was offering 0-60 in 4.5s and 0-100 in 9.3.  The car you're referring to offers supercar performance (to 60 at any rate) from 20-25 years ago.



And a new 911 Carrera S is 4.5s to 62

Regardless of what you call it, it is fast. I think I will have to try to get a test drive regardless.
Twelfth Monkey

I didn't say it was slow! The 911 S isn't a supecar though, at least not to my way of thinking.
Martin

The back pages of Evo makes it clear what is a Supercar and what isn't.  I know that's just one view, but they say a 911S is Sports Car and the Turbo is a Supercar, which I'd agree with.
PR

I think we all probably have different ideas of what defines a supercar. To me, a 911 Turbo isn't a supercar, no matter how quick it is. A supercar should drop jaws, cause double takes and have people reaching for their camera phones. I know that's an entirely subjective measure that you can't include a database but it's a reality of that type of car!
Martin

I was thinking more about performance levels i.e. A 911 Turbo is 'Supercar quick', but you're right.  Some cars do blur the boundries though for me, the R8 being a classic example.  A V10 Spyder does press the supercar buttons but a V8 coupe (lovely car that it is) doesn't.
PhilD

PR wrote:
By then I imagine Dr Keating will have invented a car that accelerates so quickly it actually reverses time.


They should make a film about that.
PR

And possibly use another disastrous and ill-conceived car as the star. I think you're onto something!
simonp

Autocar figured the RS6 at 3.7 secs to 60, did they not? Does that make it a supercar or a hypercar?

Twelfth Monkey

Borderline, but probably not!

I agree about the 911.  Might just be me, but cylinder count and noise are essential ingredients, neither of which the 911 Turbo has, for me at least.
PhilD

Twelfth Monkey wrote:
Borderline, but probably not!

I agree about the 911.  Might just be me, but cylinder count and noise are essential ingredients, neither of which the 911 Turbo has, for me at least.


It's too cute, Supercars can't be cute.
Stuntman

PR wrote:
A supercar should drop jaws, cause double takes and have people reaching for their camera phones. I know that's an entirely subjective measure that you can't include a database but it's a reality of that type of car!


Yes indeedy.  Anything else isn't a supercar, regardless of how fast it goes.
PhilD

Stuntman wrote:
PR wrote:
A supercar should drop jaws, cause double takes and have people reaching for their camera phones. I know that's an entirely subjective measure that you can't include a database but it's a reality of that type of car!


Yes indeedy.  Anything else isn't a supercar, regardless of how fast it goes.


But lots of vehicles can do that, even my Punto. If I set it on fire.
TreVoR

Stuntman wrote:
PR wrote:
A supercar should drop jaws, cause double takes and have people reaching for their camera phones. I know that's an entirely subjective measure that you can't include a database but it's a reality of that type of car!


Yes indeedy.  Anything else isn't a supercar, regardless of how fast it goes.


Agree with this completely.
franki68

the 911 turbo is not a supercar,it may be faster than most supercars,but so is a gtr,neither are supercars.I can't define a supercar apart from how it makes you feel when you drive it,as wonderful as porsches are they don't make you feel like a ferrari,lambo or aston.
btw the new gtr nismo about to be launched is about to reset the rule books,they are trying to get it to 60 in under 2 secs.

And the new carrera s ...maybe 4.5 seconds manual,the pdk cracks 4 seconds  and having driven one back to back with a 997gt3 it is possibly faster than the gt3.
PhilD

franki68 wrote:
wonderful as porsches are they don't make you feel like a ferrari,lambo or aston.


Aston have never made a Supercar (IMO) as far as I can remember, though the One-77 blurs the lines!
Parm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supercar
franki68

PhilD wrote:
franki68 wrote:
wonderful as porsches are they don't make you feel like a ferrari,lambo or aston.


Aston have never made a Supercar (IMO) as far as I can remember, though the One-77 blurs the lines!


thats down to how you define a supercar though ,does a supercar have to be mid engined ?
gonnabuildabuggy

TreVoR wrote:
Stuntman wrote:
PR wrote:
A supercar should drop jaws, cause double takes and have people reaching for their camera phones. I know that's an entirely subjective measure that you can't include a database but it's a reality of that type of car!


Yes indeedy.  Anything else isn't a supercar, regardless of how fast it goes.


Agree with this completely.


My E500 has a 0-60 of approx 5.3 seconds and whilst to me it's a super car, I'd not classify it anywhere near a supercar.

It is fun doing it though.
Parm

http://www.rfactorcentral.com/painters_profile.cfm?ID=drew55

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