| Archive for The Motor Forum talking cars since 2006 |
| Turbonutter |
Focus RS road testIn Autocar todayJust sneaks under 14 to the ton Manages 4.5 stars out of 5 Some nice pics at the bottom of page 53 |
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| Nice Guy Eddie |
Only 4.5 stars, didn't they describe this car as the greatest hot hatch ever. Seems some of the shine must have come off it already. | ||||||
| Turbonutter |
They've given the R26R 4 stars and said the Focus is more useable which I guess is fair comment given the tyres and lack of rear seats for a hot hatch. I thought it might be a smidge quicker to 100 bearing in mind the heavier 335i manages better and the Focus is nearly the same to 60 |
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| Dr. Hfuhruhurr |
These are their supposedly super-tough star ratings, where a decent but not outstanding car gets 2.5 or 3, instead of 3.5 or 4. They also gave the GT-R 4.5 the other week. Looking forward to getting the mag to read the test anyway: with the exception of the aforementioned Nissan and the Black Series last month, their tests this year have been a bit on the worthy side. | ||||||
| Turbonutter |
Yep, as per the other post they should have run the GT2 through the testing mill whilst they had it on the runway 
Chris Harris did half a job on video against the Z-06 
The road tests are 75% of the reason I buy Autocar every week |
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| Dr. Hfuhruhurr |
Likewise. And their performance figures are the ones that people tend to refer to, e.g. evo using their results for the XK220. I'd like to see the following cars fully figured: Porsche GT2 Corvette ZR1 Veyron (obviously!) Caparo T1 Jaguar XKR/XFR Alfa 8C |
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| Guitar Zero |
RWD is always quicker off the line
Best to compare the 60 to 100 mph times to get a fairer comparision 335i will be quicker anyway - they are close to 350 bhp out of the box and don't they have more torque (and a better spread of it) on account of greater cubic capacity and the twin turbos ? IIRC - RS limits torque in 1st and 2nd gears to aid traction |
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| Scouse |
That was because Autocar was the only 'official' road test though surely? Just like the F1 IIRC |
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| Dr. Hfuhruhurr |
Test on the website:
http://autocar.co.uk/CarReviews/R...History/Ford-Focus-2.5-RS/240235/ |
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| Twelfth Monkey |
Very front-heavy, isn't it? 63%. Makes the engineering and handling even more creditable, though this and fwd may help explain why it seems to have worked its fronts quite so hard. | ||||||
| simonp |
Perhaps the half star downgrade is due to it eating a set of tyres in 3500 miles? | ||||||
| Dr. Hfuhruhurr |
This is Autocar - it would lose half a star if it DIDN'T eat its front tyres in an unfeasibly short time. | ||||||
| "him" |
So are you saying it is actually a 4 star car and it got a bonus 1/2 star for doing just that?
Controversial... |
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| scamper |
14 seconds to 100 does not sound that great - Boxster S performance before the cayman engine. As GZ says, 60-100 would be more interesting. There again anything under 14 is seriously quick.
I'd still prob fancy a 335i especially as pre-registered ones were clogging up dealers for 25k not that long ago. |
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| Turbonutter |
That's the thing though, the RS only dropped 0.3 of a second to 60 where you'd expect it to suffer because of torque limiting and fwd....it's dropping more time from 60-100 to the heavier BM which is a a bit less torquey in fact according to figures ( Focus RS is 320lb ft from 2k -> 4k, BM peaks at 295lb/ft but better torque spread as you say from 1300 -> 5000rpm ). Those 335i horses must be bigger or as you say 350bhp out the box (? )......but then you could say the M3 is immensely quicker as that is only 60bhp more, weighs an extra 80kg more and is 2.6 seconds quicker to 100 over the 335i! ( which is a noticeable gap ) All number crunching really but it's a slow day 
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| scamper |
As Racing will testify, the 335i has instant torquey shove from nothing and just keeps pulling - very impressive | ||||||
| Turbonutter |
Yep, I drove a 335i at the BM dealer in Shrewwsbury - lovely engine |
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| scamper |
Me too. Although they could only get hold of a dark red cabrio. Talking of which, i'm surprised i have not met you on the road yet - i cross the A5 at the Oteley Rd/A458 roundabout every day! edit: i drive the 135i cabrio 
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| Racing |
Yes the twin-turbo straight six does pull immensely well.
But the 335i doesn't have 350bhp. In fact it has precisely the same 306 gee-gees as my 135i. So in fact the M3 has an extra 114bhp over a 335i, although interestingly both cars kick out an identical 400nm of torque. |
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| Dr. Hfuhruhurr |
That's what BMW tell you, presumably meaning that even on a 50C day in Dubai, and running on 95 petrol, you will still get at least 306 nags. Therefore in the UK, running on 98, the figure is likely to be somewhat higher. |
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| Racing |
But then presumably the same is also true of an M3, is it not? Meaning that nevertheless the M3 has circa 35% more bhp than a 335i/135i. |
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| ALF |
Temperature will affect a turbo more than an NA - for good and bad (i.e. the variation will be more).
14 seconds to the ton sounds quick but not stellar - then again the FocusST always seems a tad slower against the clock than you'd expect. Both seem to be great cars to drive, though, which is what matters. But Focus RS pilots had better avoid trying to out-drag 135/335i's... or 335d's for that matter... |
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| Guitar Zero |
Focus ST has always been ball park for turbo hatch performance
Autocar figured the ST on a soaking wet track - 0 to 60 in 6.9 seconds and 0 to 100 in 16.8 seconds. The wetness fecked the take off and effectively added a second to the 0 to 100 time. When you look at the 60 to 100 mph time, you can see that 9.9 seconds is bang on the money. I don't think there was any hot hatch quicker than that save for the 147 GTA. Evo figures for the ST had 0 to 100 mph in 15.8 seconds and Auto und Motorspunken got 15.4 seconds from their test car and a 60 to 100 mph time of 9.5 seconds. Of more concern to me is the fact that the RS is barely a nat's minge quicker than the ST260 Mountune conversion to 100 mph (which BTW, you insure as a production model in it's own right, rather than as a modified ST - I know, I've checked). Aside from a value for money issue - the RS comes with all sorts of baggage over and above the rucksack wearing ST. It looks fantastic, is even more ferociously warbly than an ST and will no doubt eat up and shit out any road you throw at it - but I'm a fat idiot - not a " dab of oppo ", Chris Harris Padwan type, so I would have a mountune ST and a fack load of change please. I wonder if Milltek could make an ST sound like half an S8 V10 ?? |
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| simonp |
Do a youtube search for focus asbo to hear what an exhausted ST can sound like. There's some rubbish music on the vid but the bit where the car roars away is gert lush
(I can't do the link coz I'm on my phone) |
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| "him" |
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4nc4V8k1qpE&feature=related | ||||||
| scamper |
Gert lush? That's a Bristolian saying, isn't it? Usually said in the same breath, when they are banging on about fecking Portishead or Massive Attack. | ||||||
| Twelfth Monkey |
The RS is a seriously quick car, hampered by being a bit slow off the line. It's not fantastic up to 40, if you look at the figures. Looking at the in-gear times in comparison with the RS4, you'd need to be caning it to open much ofa gap in the lower gears. And the lap times for it and the R26RSportSport were interesting. The RS was only marginally slower in the dry, but slow in the wet (circa three seconds slower than the ST.) Still, at least it's not as crap in the wet as the Renault. Shows how poor the Renault's trackday-biased tyres are in the wet, and seems a price not worth paying for everyday use. I also need half an eye on my moonboots to observe that the RS's dry lap time was 0.2 quicker than the RS4's, though the latter was set on a greasy track at only a gnats over freezing. VP's comments suggest that the tyres were knackered poste-haste largely on the road, not on track. That really is crap. | ||||||
| Matt |
Reckon the M3's 8,200rpm range to the turbo's broad slug is the difference there? |
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| simonp |
Annoyingly I can't find the vid I mentioned. User must've removed it? | ||||||
| simonp |
BTW, my local dealer has a green RS on the forecourt if anyone wants one? £28K! | ||||||
| Guitar Zero |
335is tested on rolling roads by some American mags were putting out 340 to 350 bhp as standard.
Obviously rolling roads aren't exact - but it certainly suggests the engine is stronger than claimed by BMW. |
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| Racing |
Interesting! Perhaps I should haul my little monster off to a rolling road. Although I'd be surprised - it doesn't feel to me like it might have 340bhp. | ||||||
| Frank Bullitt |
I think you need a cold shower and a dark room, the V10 obsession is getting worrying! Not knowing much about either really, as a layman the arrival of the RS Focus wankathon appears to make the standard ST look even better value for money, incredibly, than it was before. |
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| Matt |
I saw an 06 orange 5-door ST the other day and in light of the facelift version and the OTT RS, I'd certainly be happy with one. | ||||||
| Turbonutter |
I'll keep an eye out Dan, if I'm in the 328 you'll be gone no doubt but the Sierra will keep up ( up to the value of 60mph that is..... )
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| scamper |
How does its performance compare to an E46 M3 with 340 hp ish? |
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| Racing |
No idea. Never driven an E46 M3. But apparently: E46 M3 - 338bhp, 1495kg, 0-60 = 5.0 secs. So the older car is a bit lighter and a bit more powerful (it would seem). |
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| Turbonutter |
You haven't got the BMW Performance steering wheel have you Dan? You could time a run yourself if so! Would've been good if Autocar had done a full road test on the 135i.....especially as they were running one on their long-term fleet 
The heavier 335i managed 5.4 to 60 and 12.8 to the 100 when they figured it .....bit slower to 3 figures than the E46 M3 IIRC but probably not a gap you'd notice on the road |
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| TimR |
Should be easy enough because to my ears the Milltek S8 V10 sounds like 2 Audi quattros/Fiat Coupes driving along together. |
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| Dr. Hfuhruhurr |
It might do once you've put a few more miles on it: my M3 certainly felt quicker after about 6000 miles. |
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| Apex clipper |
Couldn't that be aimed at any marque that offers the pinnacle of that particular platform? It shouts because it can! |
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| Martin |
It shouts a lot louder than your RS and too much for a near £30k car in my opinion. | ||||||
| Matt |
The first RS was pumped, but that didn't look like an ill-advised trip to Halfords. | ||||||
| ALF |
The first one looked lovely, just right - we parked next to one at the beach on Sunday. Lovely. This one is too wideboy for me since age 28 or so, i agree with that VW top brass chappie sho said the Scirocco R was being kept sensible so owners did not look like they were having a mid-life crisis. That's how I'd feel in an RS...
I see Evo's Megane R26R front tyres only lasted 7,000 miles too. On the one hand, twice as good as the Focus. On the other, still pretty short life despite the use! Of course they were soft cup-type tyres (Toyo's in this case). |
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| simonp |
My fronts are down to about 3mm and I had them fitted about 4K ago I reckon! | ||||||
| Apex clipper |
OE tyres or aftermarket? |
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| Martin |
A lad that works for me has just gone through a full set of tyres in 8,000 miles.
It's a 2.2 diesel Civic....there must be something quite wrong due to the mileage and the way they had worn, the nearside rear went pop on the M1 last night as it had worn away completely on the inside edge! |
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| Apex clipper |
A full set! Point him in the direction of a good garage..please! Or is it one of those comedy 'Big top' clown cars that falls to pieces..ala laurel and hardy? |
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| . |
Bloody hell! I know they are pretty pokey, but ive never found the Civic lacking in traction. The one I drive in the office quite regularly is on 9,500 and has plenty of miles left on its factory fitted tyres. Mind you - 12-13K is good going for fronts on the Focus.
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| Matt |
Yeah but you get that great road to drive down on to-and-fro work you lucky bugger! 
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| simonp |
Same as OE. Originals were eked out to 10K roughly, but were gone a while before that, maybe 8.5 or so. I quite often nearly hit other cars up the arse on roundabouts as they don't assume I'll be going round them so quickly and pull out in my path!
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| Turbonutter |
Did you say you had a 135i cabrio Dan? What colour is it?
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| scamper |
Ah, i meant drove the cabrio (on test).
Back home in the skoda tonight via Sainsburys and in the MX tomorrow. I usually pass through just after 8am |
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| Turbonutter |
Ah right, sorry I misunderstood
I had a 1 series cabrio behind me this morning and he seemed keen to get "motoring" - it probably wasn't a 135i though to be fair ( I never saw the back of it ). Just wondered if it had been you |
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| scamper |
If it was de-badged and with 18 inch wheels it was probebly a 120d
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| simonp |
Anyway, back to the subject matter: has anyone seen the new vid of the Focus being chased by a (rumoured) Clio 200?
Sutters reckons it outcorners and outbrakes the Ford. |
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| Matt |
The easiest way to tell is if it has front fogs or not. The 135i does without to aid cooling. A 135i also has a chrome grille, whilst the others get black bars. |
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| Rodge |
I've given up BMW spotting because so many of them look the same now. Everything has a chrome grille, big wheels, bodykits.............and either a boggo petrol or diesel engine. Give me a standard car with a decent engine any day. Back on topic, I watched the video yesterday and didn't know it was a Clio following. It sounds like a 4 pot engine all right, but looks to be extremely fast. |
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| simonp |
Why not start a BMW spotting thread? | ||||||
| Apex clipper |
Probably a RRR TYPE 26.4 With extra stickers. This the one? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQEm1c2SETk |
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| DaveGibson |
Unless it's a new M3 Edition which has a 'black chrome' grille. (Whatever 'black chrome' may be.) |
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| Blarno |
That Focus looks like it's all over the show compared to the chase car.
The more I see of the new RS, the less I'm impressed. Give me a S1 RSF any day. |
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| scamper |
Becasue there was a time when every thread ended up one way or other, hijacked as a Spotters thread 
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| simonp |
That's it. At around 20 secs or so you can make out the reflection of a very green car in the RS's paintwork. One of these perhaps? http://www.readyforthetrack.co.uk.../renaultsport-clio-200-cup-01.jpg |