Turbonutter
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Autocar 24th JuneBit on the new Panamera
Buying a secondhand E60 M5 ( even at a cheap place the parts/service prices still look a bit steep )
Jag XF 3.0D vs BMW 535D
2 pages on the EVO X FQ400 - it runs on Toyo R1R tyres - anyone tried them yet. I thought they weren't out until the autumn..?
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Dr. Hfuhruhurr
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Panamera is on the website too. Interesting that its air springs occasionally get caught out, leading them to suspect (as I do) that the steel-sprung, 2wd, non-turbo S is the pick of the range, leaving you with a handy sum to add ceramic brakes and the nicer 20" wheels (and probably metallic paint, leather and a wireless).
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Twelfth Monkey
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Or give yourself a slap and buy a Quattroporte instead!
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Guitar Zero
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Or you could give yourself a slap, wait for the new XJ, then crash your yogurt truck when you see what the interior is like - and then buy one
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Turbonutter
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| Twelfth Monkey wrote: | | Or give yourself a slap and buy a Quattroporte instead! |
Slow old things compared to the Porsche though if that matters.....( probably not in a luxury sofa )
Had a performance comparison challenge off one from the M6 toll booths the other evening and it launched well 
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Dr. Hfuhruhurr
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Judging from my experience of the 4.2 Quattroporte, I imagine the 4.7 would be more than quick enough in most situations.
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franki68
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A four door porsche is such a great idea..why did they mess it up so much ? The more i see of them the uglier they are,I actually cannot see one pleasing thing about the exterior.What a shame.
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Gurney
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Didn't the QP post a quiker EVO lap than the M5? would hardly call that slow.
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Turbonutter
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| Gurney wrote: | | Didn't the QP post a quiker EVO lap than the M5? would hardly call that slow. |
It did indeed - but there are some strange ones in those lap times. That M5 was only 5/100ths of a second faster than a BMW 330i ....and 3.5 seconds slower than the M6, 3 seconds slower than a 350z etc. Doesn't mention it being wet so I guess the circuit suits it better than the M5.
I looked up the raw stats and it is quite a heavy car at 1930/2017 kg with 400bhp so i think that makes the lap time even more impressive. I could only remark on its urge away from the toll booths as is the case with TLGPs 
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Blarno
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| Twelfth Monkey wrote: | | Or give yourself a slap and buy a Quattroporte instead! |
I'd have an A8 over any of them. If I was buying a luxo-barge, lap times and raw figures would be bottom of the list.
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Turbonutter
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| Blarno wrote: | | Twelfth Monkey wrote: | | Or give yourself a slap and buy a Quattroporte instead! |
I'd have an A8 over any of them. If I was buying a luxo-barge, lap times and raw figures would be bottom of the list. |
I tend to agree with you Blarno
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Dr. Hfuhruhurr
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I don't - the A8 would be at the bottom of my big saloon list. I find all normal Audis a bit "meh", to be honest - it's only stuff like the A2, RS4 and R8 that attracts my attention.
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Gooner
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| Blarno wrote: | | Twelfth Monkey wrote: | | Or give yourself a slap and buy a Quattroporte instead! |
I'd have an A8 over any of them. If I was buying a luxo-barge, lap times and raw figures would be bottom of the list. |
You Jessie, it's all about the S8 V10!
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franki68
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| Gooner wrote: | | Blarno wrote: | | Twelfth Monkey wrote: | | Or give yourself a slap and buy a Quattroporte instead! |
I'd have an A8 over any of them. If I was buying a luxo-barge, lap times and raw figures would be bottom of the list. |
You Jessie, it's all about the S8 V10! |
A friend has just bought one.Tremendous used buy ,he paid about £40k for a car that listed at £84k 2 years ago.Still not my cup of tea though,all these cars are too big,and its weird seeing people on here go gooey over 2+ ton cars when they dismiss things like the rs6 because it is so heavy.I see no difference between making a car like ans8 or amg s class or a m series x5.
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Gurney
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Except for the QP, I agree about the too big comment. As far as I am concerned the A8 is an overpriced box with a wheel at each corner, I see no merit in it at all and it's a waste of a good engine - when fitted with the V8/10.
Never forget May driving the early QP on TG, he adored it and it wasn't too big (or didn't seem it even if it physically is) to punt around in an enjoyable fashion.
A8's/S class/7 series are for bloated German plutocrats who deserve the monumental depreciation such a purchase undoubtedly attracts.
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Twelfth Monkey
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| franki68 wrote: | | [its weird seeing people on here go gooey over 2+ ton cars when they dismiss things like the rs6 because it is so heavy.I see no difference between making a car like ans8 or amg s class or a m series x5. |
I don't think the Quattroporte is trying to be a sports car or hod rod, more a beautiful saloon with space and pace. More big Jag than stupidly torquey AMG willy-waver.
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franki68
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| Twelfth Monkey wrote: | | franki68 wrote: | | [its weird seeing people on here go gooey over 2+ ton cars when they dismiss things like the rs6 because it is so heavy.I see no difference between making a car like ans8 or amg s class or a m series x5. |
I don't think the Quattroporte is trying to be a sports car or hod rod, more a beautiful saloon with space and pace. More big Jag than stupidly torquey AMG willy-waver. |
Still a 2 ton ,massive beasty though.I just find it strange that some can proclaim it a lovely car (which it is) but pour scorn on an rs6 which is dynamically superior and more practical and better built.
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Twelfth Monkey
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I think the RS6 is an entirely differentthing. Similar weight, accommodation and size, granted, but for me at least, the similarities end there.
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Dr. Hfuhruhurr
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And for me it's another "yeah, right, whatever" Audi.
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Gurney
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I doubt the RS6 is dynamically superior. Faster certainly but typically a sledgehammer to crack a nut.
Zero finesse.
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franki68
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| Twelfth Monkey wrote: | | I think the RS6 is an entirely differentthing. Similar weight, accommodation and size, granted, but for me at least, the similarities end there. |
that isn't the point I am making,I am not comparing the cars,merely pointing out that it is not consistent to not like the audi because it weighs 2 tonnes.The QP could be any 2_ ton car.If I said I don't like the audi because it is 2 tonnes and then go out and buy a bentley gt ..it wouldn't make sense.
Similar argument with SUVs and luxury cars...they take up the same ridiculous roadspace,weigh the same..but it is not alright to have an SUV ,but is ok to have an S8 ???? It doesn't seem right to criticise one car for something and then like another car which has exactly the same issue.(I don't like that car because it is red..then go out and buy a red car ???)
Anyway talking of whihc Im off to test drive the maserati GT (S version )later today ,although I have heard bad stuff about the build quality from a guy In the gym yesterday who was driving one,its a fabulous looking thing.
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Guitar Zero
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RS6 is the goolies - period
Forget the ezzzztate and concentrate on the saloon - the best and most ferocious looking performance saloon ever
Have a read of Chris Harris' DR review of the RS6 saloon
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Nice Guy Eddie
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Very easy to understand, one is beautiful and would make you feel great just seeing it the other is a middle managers express with a big engine. A superb point and squirter but provides little else.
The Maserati is on another level altogether.
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Gurney
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| Nice Guy Eddie wrote: | Very easy to understand, one is beautiful and would make you feel great just seeing it the other is a middle managers express with a big engine. A superb point and squirter but provides little else.
The Maserati is on another level altogether. |
Exactly.
The RS6 would, like a Ferrari, make me feel somewhat embarrased. Undoubtedly the RS6 is a monstrous car but a Maser for me makes all the rest appear as if they are trying too hard.
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franki68
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| Nice Guy Eddie wrote: | Very easy to understand, one is beautiful and would make you feel great just seeing it the other is a middle managers express with a big engine. A superb point and squirter but provides little else.
The Maserati is on another level altogether. |
that again is missing th e point.
pretend Scenario...I hate 4wd cars,when an r8 is reviewed I say ...well its great but its 4wd which i hate.
I then go and buy a ..I don't know ...a GTR ...oh i forgot i hate 4wd...never mind.
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Twelfth Monkey
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There is no 'point', only opinion.
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franki68
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sorry 12th,stating that several people dismissed the rs6 for being too heavy,and then proclaimed a fondness for a car that is the same weight is not an opinion,that is a fact..it happened.
Im just curious how one can do that ? do we forgive a vehicle because it is beautiful despite it contradicting our own tastes ?
IM not having a go,just curious as I cannot get my head round that.I like the QP it is the nicest looking large saloon there is and would completely understand someone wanting to buy one...I just don't understand it if that someone complained about how much another car weighed when the weight is very similar.
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GonnaBreakABuggy
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I'm I the only one that thinks the the QP looks like a great big steaming pile of dog s***?
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"him"
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Nope...
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Guitar Zero
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I don't think the QP is beautiful
It has some beautiful angles, but as a whole it doesn't work for me - I think it's the front end, the headlights are too small and the front is too pouty.
I'm not to keen on the interior either, but you can't argue with the choice of the materials
Where the QP scores is it's engine - even at idle and when mooching around at low speeds it sounds delightful. It may not be as ferociously accelerative as the Jag/Porsche/Audi/Merc alternatives, but the soundtrack would more than make up for it (as it does in the S8 V10).
The only other issue I have with the Quatty Potty would concern it's ride quality - a luxury saloon that doesn't offer peerless ride and refinement is like tits on a teapot (i.e, pointless). If you main desires are a " sell your soul to the devil " engine note and pin sharp handling, why in the name of buggering bollocks would you buy an 18 foot long, leather lined carrycot ?
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Gurney
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Styling as ever is down to individual taste but nothing i've read of the new GTS and here's a snippet:-
It’s classy, though you won't think so at first. You’ll be put off by the light steering, the darty response, and the nuggety-firm ride over potholes. But it’s got depth, this car. Take a medium-fast corner, turn in, and immediately the car responds. What’s more, after a sniff of initial roll, the car stays planted on a trajectory, super-settled, screaming confident thoughts at you. Tweak the steering and the car obliges; tackle a switchback-sequence and you really are in a sports car, rather than a five-metre long four-door. Throw in bumps and cambers, and the ride is transformed into an interference-free class act that is never knocked off course, stays keyed into the road and leaves you marvelling at the quality of the damping.
Would suggest the ride would piss me off.
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Gooner
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Hey I never said I disliked the RS6, I think it's an awesome machine and, for me, the ultimate German super-saloon. The S8 is probably the better used buy right now though.
It's Autocar that don't like the RS6, I noticed they banished it from the price-lists at the back of the mag.
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simonp
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| GonnaBreakABuggy wrote: | | I'm I the only one that thinks the the QP looks like a great big steaming pile of dog s***? |
I'll join your group. Looks like a Rover 400 from the rear!
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Frank Bullitt
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| franki68 wrote: | | ...several people dismissed the rs6 for being too heavy... |
You forgot to mention dull
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Twelfth Monkey
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| franki68 wrote: | | sorry 12th,stating that several people dismissed the rs6 for being too heavy,and then proclaimed a fondness for a car that is the same weight is not an opinion,that is a fact..it happened. |
No need to apologise. If someone views them as different types of car, there is no contradiction.
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Turbonutter
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I must admit I can't see that it is anything brilliant. I prefer the Alfa 8C for all its flaws if I was going to have an Italian car to cruise round in and look nice
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